What is it about all those techniques?

[Benedicta]

Hi there. I am new in town and i really have a curiosity. What is it about all those techniques?

Since i remember myself from the very beginning, I just sleep and see lucid dreams. For a very long time, i tought everyone dreams like that. Then one day people told me they don't. So I also learned it's possible to control the dreams, I tried and did it immediately. While you guys talk with all those geekish terminology, i feel like a hillbilly.

And you say something like "low lucid level" and "high lucid level", what is that?

[pj]

Hello, Benedicta, and welcome to Mortal Mist!

May I move your post to a new thread somewhere where it is likely to garner more attention?  These are very good questions.  Your asking them reveals you to be what the rest of us mere mortals refer to as a "Natural" - somebody who can do this without any special effort.

For the rest of us, we need to work at it.  That's where the techniques come in - they are various methods that people have used to attain lucidity in their dreams.

The "levels of lucidity" is a matter that stirs some controversy, so even using it is really a matter of personal choice.  We observe that lucid dreams do tend to range from those where we are marginally aware that we are dreaming and just sort of "going with the flow" to those where we seem to be able to exercise full waking consciousness and wield tremendous control over everything.

[Benedicta]

Sure, you can move it anywhere you like. Where will you move it?

By low and high, you mean the consciousness and control levels then?
What if you are able to control but you dont choose it?

By the way, thanks for the warm welcoming.

[pj]

Would "General Lucidity Discussion And Experience" be ok, with a thread title, "What Is It About All Those Techniques?"

Or I could just create a separate thread for it right in this forum - it is certainly appropriate!  It just seems a shame to have it tagged on to a discussion about a table of contents.

[Benedicta]

I really have so much to ask. I don't know much lucid dreamers around. I found your website while i was stumbling. Just tell me where to shoot my "natural" questions

[pj]

Well, we do have a small Natural's board here that is off limits to all but the Naturals.  I'll add you to that board.  Other questions can go anywhere they seem to fit - it's just that starting a new thread will make it easier for others to spot it for what it is.  Questions make our world go 'round!

Meanwhile, I'll add you to the Natural's group so you can poke around in there.  Look under the Lucid Dreaming group for that forum.

We have over 20 "naturals" among us, though not all are very active.  If you ever see Luminous or Naiya around in chat or elsewhere, you might want to try hooking up with either of them - both are very prolific naturals.

[Benedicta]

Thanks a lot, PJ!

[Namaste]

Cool a 'natural' - your so lucky I am always envious of those who can Lucid Dream anytime they sleep. It's often hard work not being a 'natural' when you are interested in lucidity :(  I am certainly feeling quite 'un-natural' at the moment

[pj]

By low and high, you mean the consciousness and control levels then?
What if you are able to control but you dont choose it?

That's kind of where the controversy comes in.  Different people choose to rate their dreams differently, and different people choose to interact with their dreams differently.

Our most prolific lucid dreamer here, a natural, usually chooses not to control her dreams, though most of hers would be considered very high level.

This is one of those areas that still has a lot of room for discussion and exploration.

[Benedicta]

What about just believing in the possibility? I always think that it's just a matter of feeling certain about your ability. If you believe you are able to, you are able to. Like riding a bicycle. Or laughing. Or falling in love. Noone can experience those stuff by thinking the dinamics of it. You just have to believe in yourself, stop questioning, and flow.

[fisherj]

What about just believing in the possibility? I always think that it's just a matter of feeling certain about your ability. If you believe you are able to, you are able to. Like riding a bicycle. Or laughing. Or falling in love. Noone can experience those stuff by thinking the dinamics of it. You just have to believe in yourself, stop questioning, and flow.

I think this is a lovely way to think about it! I wish I had your natural ability, the frequency of my lucid dreams is a lot less than i'd like!

[Namaste]

I think your right in that a lot of us are probably getting in our own way!

When I make statements like LDing can be challenging for none naturals then it keeps me from lucid dreaming more.

Got to get into the flow Jumps...

[Benedicta]

Pj, I dont have any idea how you calculate the level of the lucidness, but i usually dont choose to control my dreams much as well. Cause when you manipulate the natural flow, you sometimes block the things you are supposed to learn. I do ask a lot of questions to the dream characters or choose my own acts (such as my flying style) but i dont prefer to touch the dream realizm unless it's asked me to. For me, the most important thing is to be aware and observe.

For my own definition, there are three types of lucid dreams.

1- You are aware you are dreaming. It's full of subconscious images but nothing special. You recognize them, even analize them into the dream. I sometimes play in them, control them, just for fun.

2- Some dreams that some characters are teaching you stuff. Such as being in different places at the same time, or jumping into paralel universes, different time zones, or cathching the resonance of the other envoriments. I dont touch these dreams unless it's a part of the lesson. I just ask questions.

3- These lucid dreams are the most beautiful, powerfull and special ones. It doesnt happen much often. There is a high level of comminucation in them with (probably) some supreme beings. They comminucate with you not by words but by feelings. A huge amount of energy connects with you and makes you feel something. Not something, many things. Like they upload you, i dont know how i must call it. You feel just like you are able to do anything you want, just like the fucking Neo or something. They are the most welcoming moments of my life. I forget who i am, what i do for living in real life, all about bills and trafic jam and every lousy things. I just become one with them. In those dreams, i never ever control anything. Cause i know, it's supposed to be just like that.

[pj]

That is an amazing set of definitions, Benedicta.  I think I've experienced #3 once in my life that I am aware of, and it was during a sleep phase when it is normally presumed we don't dream - just after I fell asleep.

Your choice on mostly letting your dreams play out is in line with Dr. LaBerge's advice.

[The Littlest Leaf Dragon]

Pj, I dont have any idea how you calculate the level of the lucidness, but i usually dont choose to control my dreams much as well.

Well, I can't speak for everyone, but the scale I use for level of lucidity goes something like this:

1 - Dreamer realizes they are dreaming but displays no further awareness and soon forgets.
2 - Dreamer realizes they are dreaming, and while they stay lucid through the dream, they display no significant level of awareness and aren't able to make more than minor choices (ie, if you're fighting, for example, you may choose to use magick instead of a gun or sword, but you don't have the level of awareness/conscious thought necessary to break away from the plot of the dream).
3 - Dreamer keeps lucidity and displays enough awareness/conscious thought that they can choose whether they want to follow the dream or not, and can make major and minor decisions.
4 - Dreamer displays level 3 criteria and in addition remembers specific knowledge such as techniques, tasks, and other things set through intent in the mundane.
5 - Dreamer is fully aware, and displays [nearly] all mental capabilities/capacity possessed in the waking world, including full waking memory.

It's basically a scale taken and adapted from the one used by Ed Kellog.